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View Full Version : Shelby Cobra for $35K, not a penny more


nospeedlimit
08-21-2005, 01:59 PM
Hi, I'm a newbie here and the last Ford I owned was a Ford Tempo 1984 (bought used in 1987). So I'm not really a Ford fan. Some of my dislikes for Ford could be attributed to my own ignorance about the Ford Line (can you blame me, after the Tempo experience I did not want to hear Ford any more) and the "uglification" of the Mustang over the past 30 years. However, I have been drawn to the new Mustang (like just about everyone else) in the past year. I did some limited research and realized that I wanted more power than the current GT. I decided that the 07 Cobra (or whatever they are calling it) would be my next car.

I then stumbled on to this site and realized that the rumors are for a huge markup by the "stealers". $100,000? :rotf: For a Ford? :rotf:

Not even for the GT. Get real.

I have made the mistake of buying a first run edition twice in the last 5 years. I got my PT Cruiser the first month it came out (piece of crap car even after I put a turbo stage II on it) and I currently own a 2003 Chevy SSR Vin#1725 . I got both at sticker since I had put my name on a list 2 years in advance.

The Cobra 07 is not really a first run but can be treated as one. From experience, I will tell you that the "stealers" will jack the price up 10K initially (remember the TB) but many will sell at sticker. In a year they will be selling it at a considerable discount. Only car enthusiast would want one, the rest will get a GT version of the Mustang. I love my SSR and will probably keep it for a few more years. It still turns heads but I wish I had waited for an 05 to get the extra ponies. (heck it's cruiser not a racer, I keep telling myself)

But to pay 50K for this car is insane let alone $100,000. The C6 Z06 is just around the corner with better performance. The new BMW M5 is coming out next year for about $75k if you need a 4 seater. Lets not talk about the E55 AMG by MB with a price tag around $80K. There are so many many cars I would considerer if I wanted to spend 100K. A Mustang is not one of them.


Now having said that, I would love to own one of these new cobras for 35K and I bet I will get one one year post production.

bobbys97r
08-26-2005, 12:10 AM
wow why are you on this site

Cobra4me
08-26-2005, 01:05 AM
your on the wrong forum. Do a search on pt cruiser forum

bbrence
09-03-2005, 07:12 PM
To bobbys97r:

You Sonny, are not only rude, "you're" illiterate. It's "you're" or "you are", not "your". The guy makes a lot of sense. Ford is fully aware that $50K-100K is out of the question for a Mustang. The car was never designed for that market.....even the Cobra. Be honest, it is a great performer for the money, but in no way, does it have the fit and finish necessary to compete in that price range.

Bottom line: [u]The 2007 Cobra, GT 500, SVT or whatever, is "NOT" a Shelby in any sense of the word. Shelby was paid a few bucks for the use of his name, and a few photo-ops. Shelby didn't design it or build it!!!!! It's a Ford Mustang with a supercharged engine and a bit more attention paid to the drive train......a bit more attention to the quality of the interior. YOU would be a total idiot to pay much more than $40k. Racing stripes and a supercharger are not worth an extra $15,000. My guess is that MSRP will be set at $39K and change. Ford knows it's market!

I bought a new 2004 SVT Cobra for $29K. I Bought a 2004 Premium GT for $21.5K $7.5K for IRS, DOHC supercharged, better built engine, better leather seats, better wheels, better tires, better brakes...... seemed like a fair price to me. But $40K???? Thats pushing the limit!!!!

jjraiser
09-07-2005, 09:29 AM
bbrence, amen, brother! The car is good, but it just won't be that good.

Besides, there isn't a soul out there that's going to pay 100,000 for a GT500 (If so, they'd be the biggest moron north of the South Pole). Ford dealers know this too. I agree, there will be a considerable mark-up, just like we're seeing on the Mustang GTs and even V6s. Is the car worth the mark-up? I don't think so, but many do, so they'll sell at the higher price. How much? Probably at least $10K higher, but who cares?

I know this, if someone pays $100,000 (or close to it) for a GT500, they better save a bit of that money to get their head examined. :p

kilroy
09-07-2005, 10:26 AM
To bobbys97r:

You Sonny, are not only rude, "you're" illiterate. It's "you're" or "you are", not "your". The guy makes a lot of sense. Ford is fully aware that $50K-100K is out of the question for a Mustang. The car was never designed for that market.....even the Cobra. Be honest, it is a great performer for the money, but in no way, does it have the fit and finish necessary to compete in that price range. I agree with your pricing point bbrence - Edit: I was embarrassed by bobby's post.

Nospeedlimit, expect ~$40k out the door. There are always dealerships who mark up +$5k for the right to have the first on the block. The new "Shelby GT500" will be no exception.

Bottom line: [u]The 2007 Cobra, GT 500, SVT or whatever, is "NOT" a Shelby in any sense of the word. Shelby was paid a few bucks for the use of his name, and a few photo-ops. Shelby didn't design it or build it!!!!! It's a Ford Mustang with a supercharged engine and a bit more attention paid to the drive train......a bit more attention to the quality of the interior. YOU would be a total idiot to pay much more than $40k.~ In this day & age, it most certainly is a Shelby. Carroll was brought in as a consultant & allowed FoMoCo to leverage his name as a result. It's not just a Mustang with stripes & a blower as you suggest. Because of Shelby's input, it's a bit more.

Shelby History
(http://www.uniqueperformance.com/shelbyhistory.aspx)I guess the 68-70 Shelbys aren't really Shelby's either, by your definition. I'm sure A.O. Smith would disagree...
http://hotrod.com/toc/hr_0506_cover.jpg

bobbys97r
09-10-2005, 07:24 PM
:) :) :) :) :) :)

bobbys97r
09-10-2005, 07:25 PM
:) :) :) :) :) :) :) :)

RF Cobra
09-10-2005, 09:33 PM
If you can't carry on a civilized conversation then you need to continue it off the board either through email or PM. :edmond:


I believe this thread is about the 07 Shelby GT 500 and pricing...keep it on topic without the personal attacks guys.

bbrence
09-10-2005, 09:40 PM
Well, if it makes you happy to call it a Shelby, go right ahead, BUT the original Shelby group that engineered and built the Cobra and customized the Mustang GT 350R, NO LONGER EXISTS!!! So called "Shelby continuation cars" are built by an entirely different company in Texas. Shelby "consulted" [whatever that means] on the 2007? This concept car was completely designed and built "in house" at Ford Motor company.....as will all the production models. Calling it a Shelby doesn't make it one.......it's called "Marketing"! It's not a bad car, may even be a great car.......but it's a Shelby in name only!

bobbys97r
09-10-2005, 11:08 PM
:) :D :) :D :) :D

RF Cobra
09-11-2005, 12:02 AM
poor old guy I didnt mean to make him :bawling: that mid life thing is rough I hear
:zz: Oh, I guess that was supposed to make me mad and join in your flame war dribble. Sorry. :rolleyes:

It'll be over a decade before I'm even close. It might help if you knew what you were talking about when you posted. I just think it is funny that the 2 year olds I teach exhibit more maturity than those who are a lot older and supposedly smarter that get into petty flaming/arguments and name calling over nothing.

You may want to try www.svtperformance.com (http://www.svtperformance.com) I hear they have hundreds of people with nothing better to do than to start silly flame wars and name calling contests. I only wish I had that much spare time on my hands... :)

bobbys97r
09-11-2005, 11:17 AM
;) :) :D ;) :) :D

kilroy
09-12-2005, 12:41 AM
It might help if you knew what you were talking about when you posted. I just think it is funny that the 2 year olds I teach exhibit more maturity than those who are a lot older and supposedly smarter that get into petty flaming/arguments and name calling over nothing. own.T http://instagiber.net/smiliesdotcom/cwm/cwm/rcain.gif

Firme
09-12-2005, 02:51 AM
absolutely no personal attacks will be tolerated on these forums. If people want to call other people names, please do it elsewhere.

This is my only warning. Please treat others with respect, or you will post here no more. The SCMC member forums are to remain friendly, mature, and family oriented. We also promote camaraderie.

bobbys97r
09-12-2005, 05:40 PM
Well, if it makes you happy to call it a Shelby, go right ahead, BUT the original Shelby group that engineered and built the Cobra and customized the Mustang GT 350R, NO LONGER EXISTS!!! So called "Shelby continuation cars" are built by an entirely different company in Texas. Shelby "consulted" [whatever that means] on the 2007? This concept car was completely designed and built "in house" at Ford Motor company.....as will all the production models. Calling it a Shelby doesn't make it one.......it's called "Marketing"! It's not a bad car, may even be a great car.......but it's a Shelby in name only!
Shelby "consulted" [whatever that means]
it means he got to take a few of them out and rip on them for a bit and he gets one in every color:thumbsup:

bobbys97r
09-12-2005, 05:42 PM
:teleport: :starwars: :ttiwwop: :spanked: :raise: :007: :spank2: :tomcat: :bump: :tongue: :wildguy: :blast: :firebounc :bounce: :shockwave :evil: :smack: :spimpin: :facedrop: :vampsmile :spoke: :side: :dizzy: :edmond: :getsome: :woot: :hello: :barf: :retard: :banana: :flash: :fordflag: :flash: :burnout: :whipit: :jason: :typer: :touche: :stupid:

Blown96Snake
09-16-2005, 04:47 PM
It is going to be an interesting situation when these cars come out. I think they will be extremely hot! Every product has a similar life cycle...some "mature" a little faster than other.

I feel like there will be a lot of people who will pay $45-$50k for one of these cars. Ford is now only talking about making 7000 units. They also will allow any dealer who signs up for the program (easy) to have at least one unit. Then, some dealers will be able to aquire another unit based on different criteria. I think we (Parkway) will get somewhere in the neighborhood of 4-5. I think there are close to 5000 Ford dealers in the US. :(

From the dealer's perspective...the first units hitting the ground will go for "market value". Whatever that will be, then the markup will decrease as demand decreases. So I would not be surprised to see early GT500's for $10-$15 over sticker. We are still selling GT Convertibles for around $36k...(these are cars we have aquired from other dealers, auctions etc., so its not like we are killing it on them...its to keep up our image :cool:

We'll just have to wait and see...

Dave

Stavesacre21
09-20-2005, 03:59 AM
Now having said that, I would love to own one of these new cobras for 35K and I bet I will get one one year post production.Don't hold yur breath on that one. Even though they do seem to be marked high, i'd highly doubt that they'd drop down over $5K under invoice in the first year....especially with them being marked much higher above invoice to begin with. However, I suppose you could maybe pick one up with some miles on it for that price.

On a side note, did you purposly come here to only stir the waters? Just curious...

Lights of speed
09-21-2005, 12:19 PM
yea you need to go to a rice site ^^^^^ im wid all them!

ProfChaos
09-23-2005, 03:49 AM
Though many people likely gave-up reading this thread after it got so testy and "go away, boo-hiss-confrontational", it's funny that I happened upon the thread on the same day that I also inquired into getting on the list for the '07 Shelby ("Cobra") GT 500 :) I faced the "not-a-penny-over-MSRP Dragon" today and won. Interestingly enough, I got two answers on whether or not most dealers would be gouging people on the car: one from the Sales Manager, and one from the Associate to whom he forwarded me for recording of name, phone number, etc.

The Sales Manager would not give a definitive answer--seemed confused in that he more than once mistakenly thought that I meant that I wanted to be put on the waiting list for the Ford GT. What he did say was that he thought that "supply and demand"--a favorite term of heartless, greedy equivocators--would lead the price of the '07 Shelby GT 500 to be more than $10K over MSRP..."Not for me it won't be," I replied: "I remember as a young man reading about how so many people got ripped-off on the 1978 Indy Pace Car L-82 Corvettes--paying up to $65K for a car that cost only $20K later in the year." (GM boosted production numbers of the 1978 L-82 Indy Pace Car by an outrageous amount and consequently outraged many loyal Corvette buyers--some of whom probably never bought another Corvette.)

On the other hand, the Sales Associate to whom the above Sales Manager forwarded me offered a more common-sense reply than his manager did. He said that one should never pay more than MSRP for any Ford vehicle, and that shifty dealers who gouge people to cash-in on hype surrounding a new model deserve to lose one's business. "If this Sales Manager won't agree to do that for you, look around", he said,"you'll eventually find a dealer who will sell you a Shelby GT 500 for MSRP. You might have to wait a while for it to come in, but you should be able to pay for it--in advance--at MSRP, as soon as dealerships get approval codes for placing orders."

I thought, "Well, it's nice to know that the world is not always a greedy-grabby shark tank." :thumbsup:

cheers,
--Professor Chaos

RF Cobra
09-23-2005, 10:59 AM
I'm sure you will enjoy your purchase and not regret it. :thumbsup:

I agree in part with what you said...I think that if you pay MSRP you are still overpaying though. I know in some cases it is unavoidable. How much anyone pays all depends on how much they want what they are buying. The local dealership here still wants an extra $89k for the GT it has and thus, it has been sitting for months now. Great car, but not that great. In my opinion I think it is funny that dealerships still play mind games with the public, but I guess as long as the majority keep falling for them they will continue.

The only comment I have for the sales associate is admirable (as long as he wasn't just trying to say what you wanted to hear). But he better start looking for a new career unless he wants to stay in that position until he retires since it goes against the corporate philosophy in the car business.

Granted they are entitled to making a profit since that is why they are in business. But being overly greedy will make me go elsewhere or wait. One of our customers (the family owns a lot of the dealerships in our area) commissioned our cabinet shop to hand build custom cabinetry for the office in their house. We have done a lot of work for them over the years, and suddenly she decides to get confrontational about our overhead and profit margins over the most labor intensive project they have had us perform. Last time I checked, none of us here make enough money from our job profit that we own our own private island in the Caribbean like they do. I can also tell you from experience they will never consider giving us a discount on the purchase of any of the vehicles they sell. It is interesting how their thinking works. It is okay for them to demand it from us, but if we try to negotiate with them then we are "trying to rip them off."

At any rate, the MSRP for '04 coupes was $36K last summer, so there will not be any new 07s for $35k no matter how nasty anyone gets on here.

Of course, the one good thing I can say about them is that those who bought a Mercedes, GMC or Pontiac from one of our other customers helped pay for my Cobra so I guess it's not all bad! :D

ProfChaos
09-24-2005, 09:35 PM
I'm sure you will enjoy your purchase and not regret it. :thumbsup:

I agree in part with what you said...I think that if you pay MSRP you are still overpaying though. I know in some cases it is unavoidable. How much anyone pays all depends on how much they want what they are buying. continue.

That's true: dealerships do not pay the listed invoice price, anyway. From years of having one of the Southeast's leading Porsche/BMW dealers as a very close friend and confidante, I've learned that there is usually plenty of room to negotiate with regard to new car prices. A solid figure in terms of dealer profit margin is approximately $3000 profit-per-car, not including the 7% below invoice that the dealer actually pays for the car. Further, on recent SUV's and pickups, the going profit margin is actually closer to $6K: "The dumbest buy the mostest" (Jello Biafra of the Dead Kennedys). The seven percent below invoice that the dealer tends to pay, however, is often more-than-absorbed by issues such as paying to resolve "lot rot" (cosmetic damage from vehicles sitting around in the sun, vehicles getting scratched by knuckle-headed tire-kickers, etc.), and for the salary of the high school kid who washes and waxes the cars. That's fair enough: no one is in business to lose money, and--anyway--the kid needs money for movies and stuff. :) Even so, one can negotiate to buy a vehicle below MSRP. The past two vehicles that I bought new were puchased at $1500 over invoice (I met the dealers in the middle on two deals which took less than one hour combined, with all options at dealer's cost.) Option packages often fall into the category of "ADP" (additional dealer profit), as the individual options do not cost the dealer anywhere near what you would pay for them if you were to pay full rate. All that said, I would be very surprised if I find a dealer who would be willing to negotiate on option packages on a Shelby GT500 a figure anywhere near the dealer-cost for the particular package. This will quite likely be the place where the "supply-and-demand" part of the social contract will have its way. Even so, it's a Shelby--dad-gum it--and will always be worth more, in the long run, than a Saleen or Roush Mustang would and will always be a smarter move in the long run than even the trickiest-of-tricked-out Mustang GT's would be. :bounce:


The only comment I have for the sales associate is [that he is] admirable (as long as he wasn't just trying to say what you wanted to hear). But, he'd better start looking for a new career unless he wants to stay in that position until he retires, since it goes against the corporate philosophy in the car business [to agree to a lower profit].

Yes, but my good friend, the auto dealer mentioned above, taught me that smart, business-savvy, auto dealers realize that selling a person four or five cars over the course of her or his life is a much more profitable venture than is gouging a succession of ignorant customers. To quote his father--a very successful and reputable auto dealer in his day--, "A person who makes a living by preying upon the vulnerablity of the masses is not an entrepeneur: he is a scoundrel and a cheat, with no integrity as a business person."

Granted, they are entitled to making a profit since that is why they are in business. But, being overly greedy will make me go elsewhere or wait.

Exactly: that is my friend's father's point.
:thumbsup:

cheers,
--Professor Chaos

ProfChaos
09-24-2005, 10:36 PM
Shelby "consulted" [whatever that means]
it means he got to take a few of them out and rip on them for a bit and he gets one in every color:thumbsup:

That might be true in a practical sense, but it was Carrol Shelby who came-up with the cool "Elanor-esque" lines and the white-with-blue-racing-stripes motif/LeMans rocker panel "GT500" blue stripes of the original "Cobra". So, releasing an SVT Cobra with those styling features without crediting Carrol Shelby would essentially amount to plagiarism--"horking" someone else's ideas, without giving her or him credit.

http://bradbarnett.net/mustangs/wallpaper/07gt500/77.jpg

_____
cheers,
--Professor Chaos

ProfChaos
09-24-2005, 11:01 PM
Shelby "consulted" [whatever that means]
it means he got to take a few of them out and rip on them for a bit and he gets one in every color:thumbsup:

Further, with reference to Speed Channel's "History of the Mustang", let me note here that, during the original "Cobra" project, Carrol Shelby was given by Ford only $2000 and a 'secretary car' and went very deep into his own wallet to bring the original Cobra into being.

Thus, one might argue that his being credited in the '07 GT500 Project is merely God's Grace coming back to him--genius gets acknowledged while it still lives: "The stone that was earlier rejected becomes the head of the corner."

http://bradbarnett.net/mustangs/wallpaper/07gt500/77.jpg

_____
cheers,
--Professor Chaos

RF Cobra
09-24-2005, 11:55 PM
...Even so, it's a Shelby--dad-gum it--and will always be worth more, in the long run, than a Saleen or Roush Mustang would and will always be a smarter move in the long run than even the trickiest-of-tricked-out Mustang GT's would be. :bounce:

I agree. I could bore everyone (even myself) with the inner workings of car dealerships due to relatives and wife working for Ford and dealerships. But I wont put any of us through that and just say well said to your reply. :)




Yes, but my good friend, the auto dealer mentioned above, taught me that smart, business-savvy, auto dealers realize that selling a person four or five cars over the course of her or his life is a much more profitable venture than is gouging a succession of ignorant customers. To quote his father--a very successful and reputable auto dealer in his day--, "A person who makes a living by preying upon the vulnerablity of the masses is not an entrepeneur: he is a scoundrel and a cheat, with no integrity as a business person."

cheers,
--Professor Chaos
Then they are indeed a good dealership. :thumbsup:

I don't believe the typical stereo typing school of thought that all dealerships are bad. If so, none of them would stay in business very long. Eventually word gets out and the inflow of new people to rip off dwindles to the point that they could not remain in business. There are a couple of dealerships that I will gladly give my business two again and again in our area because they acted with integrity and treated me, the customer, with respect. I want the good ones to succeed and in order to do so they must make a profit. Our company is in business to make a profit so why shouldn't they? It is when they get into the story telling, lies and "high pressure" sales tactics that you know it is time to leave.