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View Full Version : Sometimes it goes bad wrong (TWS wreck)


Admiral
08-12-2006, 08:26 AM
Last weekend at the NASA TX event:

http://www.donovanracing.com/Micah_Bishop_TWS_Aug_6_2006_Small.wmv
(right click, save as)

Driver was ok, they are rebuilding the car now.

mrpork
08-12-2006, 08:53 AM
i guess that is why they want roll cages in these cars

Twice Bitten
08-12-2006, 09:58 AM
Glad he is ok :thumbsup: , 3 rolls :eek:

Admiral
08-12-2006, 10:07 AM
Actually, I think he got 4 rolls in there. :flip:

jimmysidecarr
08-12-2006, 11:38 AM
Glad he's ok... Cage held nicely. That car looks pretty bent up. Was he runnin a Hans or similar head restraint?

I had the sound turned down... Think he'll put..... "Let's roll" .....back on the trunk of the car after he fixes it?

None of that rolling stuff for me, thank you...

As far as end results go...

There is a big difference between picking mud out of your rotors and trying to put a car that wrecked back together.

But as for things that cause events like that...

The beginings can be nearly identicle.

93KingCobra
08-12-2006, 07:25 PM
Sad to see that.... Glad he is alright...

03 cobra toy
08-12-2006, 07:58 PM
That sucks.....I'm glad he is ok!! No more TWS for me untill I get my racing seat and Hans device....

SuperG
08-13-2006, 09:40 AM
Speaking of HANS...that is a really pricey setup. Are there any alternatives?

bluethunder
08-13-2006, 10:01 AM
Speaking of HANS...that is a really pricey setup. Are there any alternatives?


Sure..........DEATH

Levi
08-13-2006, 12:15 PM
That's scary.....I'm glad he is ok!!

03 cobra toy
08-13-2006, 12:21 PM
Speaking of HANS...that is a really pricey setup. Are there any alternatives?

All of them will cost you big $$$ :( I like the Hans better.....less straps and crap to deal with. see the link below :thumbsup:

Here is another one:

http://www.hutchensdevice.com/

Admiral
08-13-2006, 12:56 PM
There's another one that John Force uses, I can't recall the name right now. Anyway, I like it because it is self contained and doesn't rely on the seat straps. It has the SFI 38.1 certification also.

FWIW I haven't plunked down the money on any sort of Head and Neck restraint so far but it is only a matter of time before the sanctioning bodies will mandate them for liability and safety reasons.

Ah, here it is, the LFT R3 device. Warning, they have a big intro download (hate that!) on the home page:

www.lfttech.com

SuperG
08-13-2006, 02:41 PM
Wow! $325 for the Hutchens or $1150 for the HANS. Do you have to get a special helmet for either of these?

Admiral
08-13-2006, 03:15 PM
I know the HANS just requires special attachment fittings which can be glued to the helmet, not sure about Hutchens. BTW, we've found HANS for as low as $870 in the past, not sure about present pricing.

Andy M
08-13-2006, 09:06 PM
I purchased a HANS two years ago and love it. Once you get used to how to properly put it on and take it off, it becomes second nature.

I drilled the holes and attached the studs to my helmet myself. The installation instructions are really good and if you take your time and measure everything properly, it is a breeze.

Personally, I would never ever go racing without it!! I see guys spend literally thousands of dollars modding the crap out of their cars, and yet flinch at the thought of spending a grand or so on protecting their own neck! Maybe its just me, but I don't get it?!! :dunno:

Andy M
08-13-2006, 09:10 PM
Wow! $325 for the Hutchens or $1150 for the HANS. Do you have to get a special helmet for either of these?

The Hutchens is a poor mans (a very poor man's!!) HANS in my humble opinion. It is a series of straps which you must get into like Houdini in a coffin.

The HANS is the way to go!! You can get one for around $900-$1000 and they work!!!

03 cobra toy
08-13-2006, 09:52 PM
I drilled the holes and attached the studs to my helmet myself. The installation instructions are really good and if you take your time and measure everything properly, it is a breeze.

Cool! you can help me do mine :D

SuperG
08-13-2006, 10:09 PM
...Personally, I would never ever go racing without it!! I see guys spend literally thousands of dollars modding the crap out of their cars, and yet flinch at the thought of spending a grand or so on protecting their own neck! Maybe its just me, but I don't get it?!! :dunno:
Good point! It's a terrible thing whenthe car survives but the driver does not!

jimmysidecarr
08-13-2006, 10:11 PM
That LFT R3 looks like a nice piece... portable seat pad is available now.

Admiral
08-14-2006, 07:21 AM
Personally, I would never ever go racing without it!! I see guys spend literally thousands of dollars modding the crap out of their cars, and yet flinch at the thought of spending a grand or so on protecting their own neck! Maybe its just me, but I don't get it?!! :dunno:

For me it is a cost/benefit consideration. Fire suppression system, fuel cell, head and neck restraint, etc etc. At some point the $$ add up considerably.

This specific example of a sideways roll over is much less a case for Head and Neck systems but rather a glaring situation where a well built cage and proper seat/restraint devices paid off.

Now that I've typed this I'd better start shopping for a Head and Neck restraint as my odds of a head-on accident into some immovable object just went up with my luck!

SuperG
08-14-2006, 07:44 AM
For me it is a cost/benefit consideration. Fire suppression system, fuel cell, head and neck restraint, etc etc. At some point the $$ add up considerably.

This specific example of a sideways roll over is much less a case for Head and Neck systems but rather a glaring situation where a well built cage and proper seat/restraint devices paid off.

Now that I've typed this I'd better start shopping for a Head and Neck restraint as my odds of a head-on accident into some immovable object just went up with my luck!
Mike, I assume CMC does not require H&N restraints?

It seems to me over the past few years the most severe injuries have been head and neck...perhaps those are just the ones we hear of. Since I have a convertible, I have to have a roll bar, but I highly doubt it will provide the same protection as Micah's appears to have...

Andy M
08-14-2006, 09:14 AM
For me it is a cost/benefit consideration. Fire suppression system, fuel cell, head and neck restraint, etc etc. At some point the $$ add up considerably.

This specific example of a sideways roll over is much less a case for Head and Neck systems but rather a glaring situation where a well built cage and proper seat/restraint devices paid off.

Now that I've typed this I'd better start shopping for a Head and Neck restraint as my odds of a head-on accident into some immovable object just went up with my luck!Mike,

Good point and I agree!! A cage should be the first order of business. However, some sort of Head and Neck restraint system, even if it is not a HANS, SHOULD be budgeted as soon as funding permits. You do this stuff long enough and the odds will catch up with you eventually.

Admiral
08-14-2006, 09:35 AM
I think there is no substitute for a good roll cage. I doubt a roll bar provides enough protection when things go very bad. In the convertible world, I'd also recommend looking into arm restraints. Right now NASA does NOT require Head and Neck restraint devices but they plan to add that sometime soon.

Now, after saying that I must admit that in moving from my AI car (which had a great roll cage and a fuel cell) I've gone to a CMC car with the "minimums" which includes a bolt-in roll cage that doesn't give me a warm fuzzy, and a stock fuel tank. I plan on upgrading the roll cage in the off season, the speeds at TWS are just too darn high for my comfort level but once the green flag dropped last event my hair instantly was set on fire and I forgot all about safety items in the car and went to racing.

That makes me the poster boy for "racing idiot" and I need to change that very soon.

Andy M
08-14-2006, 02:13 PM
I agree with you that on that particular accident, the cage most definitely saved the guy's life. A mediocre cage OR no cage at all would have definitely put him at much greater risk. HANS or no HANS, the roof would have crushed him without a good cage. The HANS is primarily to protect your neck during a frontal collision. Like maybe messing up coming out of the S turn onto the front straight at TWS. I saw a guy in a Vette lose it there, get sideways and slam the wall straight on. He was probably doing 70-80 or so when he hit the wall. That was the guy who Fincik was riding with that time. A HANS would most definitely protect your neck from recoiling and snapping during that type of collision.

If I had it to do all over again, I would do ALL of the safety stuff first before ever spending a nickel on performance goodies... This of course includes good brakes, but should begin with things like a good cage, a HANS (or other suitable device), fire suppression, etc....

Miguel
08-14-2006, 03:16 PM
Is it me, or did that dude hit some kind of ditch that began the whole rolling thing?


Glad he is OK. If I ever go beyond yellow group DE running, I will upgrade to a good cage, and related equipment. For better or for worse I'm too broke to track frequently so it will be a while.

Andy M
08-14-2006, 04:18 PM
Is it me, or did that dude hit some kind of ditch that began the whole rolling thing?


Glad he is OK. If I ever go beyond yellow group DE running, I will upgrade to a good cage, and related equipment. For better or for worse I'm too broke to track frequently so it will be a while.Depending upon speed and how you go into a ditch and/or get sideways, it sometimes doesn't take much to get the car airborne and to begin rolling.

My advice to all who ask me is to spend money on safety items FIRST!! There will be plenty of time to make the car go faster. The nut behind the wheel needs seat time in a safe car before he can begin to go faster and remain safe.

Ok - off my soapbox!! I think I have made my point! :rolleyes:

Admiral
08-14-2006, 05:59 PM
And the most important point: STAY ON THE TRACK!!!

Bad things happen out there when you venture 4 wheels off lol. :thumbsup:

aggie97
09-05-2006, 01:01 AM
Hans Devices at www.performancespeedtech.com (http://www.performancespeedtech.com) local track shop at MSR Cresson....send them your helmet, they will install the device and ship it back to you....hans cost is $860'ish....plus tax and shipping/install.

I got mine in March and actually love it. it provides some nice padding on the shoulders for the belts and once you are used to it....you won't go without.