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95SVTCobraVA
10-28-2004, 10:37 PM
There is a VERY strong rumor going around that Ford SVT (Special Vehicle Team) may be disbanded in the future. Please go to the link listed below and sign the Petition. I can guarantee that the people at the very top of Ford Motor Company will know about and see this Petition.

http://www.petitiononline.com/mod_perl/signed.cgi?savesvt&1

Please support SVT! And pass this information on to other Ford Enthusiast!

2KWhiteSnake
10-28-2004, 11:57 PM
There is a VERY strong rumor going around that Ford SVT (Special Vehicle Team) may be disbanded in the future. Please go to the link listed below and sign the Petition. I can guarantee that the people at the very top of Ford Motor Company will know about and see this Petition.

http://www.petitiononline.com/mod_perl/signed.cgi?savesvt&1

Please support SVT! And pass this information on to other Ford Enthusiast!

It's strictly a "rumor", as you stated above. There has been things stirred up about SVT for years. They clearly stated in the press release that they were putting the lightning on hold to get the Cobra ready. Every forum on the net now concludes that SVT is folding. Even if the "taken out of context" rumor was true, Ford will do what it is going to do, regardless of how many thousands of people send in emails or faxes. We're just a group of owners that make up 1% of their total product line. The SVT line doesn't make money for them...The V6's and GT's do. It's all about volume, and 10,000 cars a year isn't a drop in the bucket compared to the 200K cars a year they sell on the lower line Mustangs. If the Cobra is ready in 2007, then I'll be the first to buy one (naturally aspirated ONLY), but if they don't, I'll move on to something else. I really can't blame them if it happens in todays economy. All Sad, but All true....it's a little game called economics. Search Google and you'll see how bad Ford is hurting at this point. They've had losses for 7 months this year, which is a record for them. I don't think many have been double digit losses, but most have been around 7% as compared to 2003. What we might think is a mere 7% is millions for a company as large as Ford. Their trucks are the only thing keeping them afloat, so I see them working hard at making them their top priority also. Keep the faith, but whatever they plan on doing will happen, regardless of what we do or say.


Craig

95SVTCobraVA
10-29-2004, 07:20 AM
"The Rumor" that is stated above came from inside SVT itself.

2KWhiteSnake
10-29-2004, 10:36 AM
"The Rumor" that is stated above came from inside SVT itself.

"Who" inside SVT stated such a rumor?. A press release came out and all of the sudden there are "Rumors from inside SVT" Where is your source of information?

Craig

cobrabitn
10-29-2004, 09:18 PM
Sometimes you don't want to tell the identity of your sources. :D My Ford sources said the same thing Craig.

Don't care what the media said in the past few months but I do care about what was said this week. :D

95SVTCobraVA
10-29-2004, 09:29 PM
Sometimes you don't want to tell the identity of your sources. :D My Ford sources said the same thing Craig.

Don't care what the media said in the past few months but I do care about what was said this week. :D

Exactly! Well said Tony!

Tony let me know when you have your letter ready I want to d/l it and sign it and put it in the mail. Every little bit helps :thumbsup:

cobrabitn
10-29-2004, 09:40 PM
No problem Tony... I'll send you a copy. I got the address I needed so I should have it in the mail on Monday.

Just for the record..... the SCMC website gets over 2 million hits per month and many, many times, we have information up on our site before the magazines ever get it. We can get a video up in a matter of minutes from an event as long as we can transmit it as soon as we finish. Other media have to wait for circulation, or red tape, or other factors that may slow them down.

Even if it is a "rumor", I would rather "nip it in the bud" then to wait till it is too late. Just my .02 worth. :thumbsup:

95SVTCobraVA
10-29-2004, 09:50 PM
I agree with everything you said Tony!

I also put a link in the CVMC Newsletter to the SCMC website. Maybe we can get a few more Mid-Atlantic Cobra owners to join.

I stated in the Newsletter that SCMC was conducting a letter writing campaign. Hopefully some will come to your site and get the letter and mail it off.

I will also mention SCMC's efforts at our monthly meeting next week.

Lthl Venom 03
10-29-2004, 11:32 PM
Ok don't get me wrong, i love SVT and don't want it to go away, but i seriously doubt a petition is going to make the slightest effect on Ford's decision on whether or not to keep SVT. They know SVT has countless fans out there, that's not in question. Even if SVT does go away it doesn't mean the cobra is going away. I don't see what would be so horrible about a Shelby Cobra :D anyhow, that's just my .02 cents

2KWhiteSnake
10-30-2004, 01:21 AM
Ok don't get me wrong, i love SVT and don't want it to go away, but i seriously doubt a petition is going to make the slightest effect on Ford's decision on whether or not to keep SVT. They know SVT has countless fans out there, that's not in question. Even if SVT does go away it doesn't mean the cobra is going away. I don't see what would be so horrible about a Shelby Cobra :D anyhow, that's just my .02 cents


I agree. Petitions won't do anything. We're not even a thought in the heads of the "big wigs" at Ford. If something is going to happen, we'll have no say so in a corporation that big. We can only keep hoping.

Craig

2KWhiteSnake
10-30-2004, 01:27 AM
No problem Tony... I'll send you a copy. I got the address I needed so I should have it in the mail on Monday.

Just for the record..... the SCMC website gets over 2 million hits per month and many, many times, we have information up on our site before the magazines ever get it. We can get a video up in a matter of minutes from an event as long as we can transmit it as soon as we finish. Other media have to wait for circulation, or red tape, or other factors that may slow them down.

Even if it is a "rumor", I would rather "nip it in the bud" then to wait till it is too late. Just my .02 worth. :thumbsup:


Our website at work gets 8 million hits a month during our off season, and my customers don't know anything before I do. A rumor is a rumor, so I'd leave it at that. If someone at SVT has the balls to tell someone else something that's "TRUE", then they've got the balls to lose their jobs. I know that Ford would fire anyone that puts out information that's "secret". I doubt that anyone would jeapordize an $85K year job for something like that. There will be an 07 Cobra, and I will buy one if it's naturally aspirated. Don't sweat the rumors...start saving for the ultimate Cobra. :)


Craig

ausie
10-30-2004, 09:01 AM
Some of you may think that a small voice will be ignored by a big company. Keep one thing in mind is that we are the consumer and that has more power than what you think when it comes down to corporate decisions. They will loose more if they ignore consumer comments on thier products and will loose valuable input from owners of their products. If a large company is to survive, they should listen to the consumer so that they can continue to produce products that will sell. Usually when it comes down to changes, some departments may be eliminated since the sales from that particular department were lower than expected. Products like the FORD GT and the Shelby concept "COBRA" remake of Shelby's creation back in the 60's will only be reachable by less than 1% of the population. I doubt that the mustang will loose interest and perhaps the SVT badging will remain unless it gets changed to "SHELBY". They can still keep the SVT and call it Shelby Vehichle Team. There is a lot of things changing in the market place and what really seems to be booming is the SUV market and offerings of 4WD vehicles other than SUV's. Since the majority of sales comes from 4 door vehicles due to many consumers with children, vehicles like the mustang and focus are targeted towards younger adults than who actually buys them. I would personally dislike to see ford drop the SVT line up in favor of a minivan or pickup truck. Ford should survey all SVT buyers to find out how many of them were previous SVT owners. Is it just FORD that is suffering or the entire corporation which includes; Mercury/Lincolin, Volvo, Jaguar, Lotus, Mazda, Range Rover, etc? I can agree that the Ford thunderbird was a big flop, I do not see any more of those on the lot. More than likely Ford will focus on what sells vrs what does not. The new Mustang platform is a gamble since the last platform was successful. A simple change like retro guages could kill the product as was the case with the thunderbird.

cobrabitn
10-30-2004, 09:43 AM
Well.... when the Ford Probe came out years ago..... that was supposed to be the new front wheel drive Mustang. As you can see, the FWD Probe is gone and the RWD Mustang is still here. That change didn't happen because the Mustang enthusiasts said they didn't want FWD and voiced their opinion to Ford.

Sorry, but I'm not one for sitting around and saying "gee, their going to do whatever they want to do". Although that may be true, if you never voice an opinion then Ford will never know how much a move like this will mean to the Ford consumer. As for not saying "who", if someone asks me not to mention who they are when they tell me in confidence, then I won't say. Having an 85K a year job has got nothing to do with it, it's got to do with confidentiality.

So, where do I go from here? Off to finish my letter to get in the mail on Monday.

Lastly, while I have the utmost respect for Carroll Shelby ( I just love the cars he made and makes), he had his time in the 60's. It's time for Coletti and company to maintain the roll they have started and keep the SVT name alive. (No, I don't want it called Shelby Vehicle Team). Besides you are on an SVT BB not a Shelby board. Let them make a Shelby Mustang but don't badge it an SVT.. Just my honest opinion!

Tony

johnbasf
10-30-2004, 11:38 AM
I'll just buy a Z0-6. :rotf: :rotf: :eek:

Silver10th
10-30-2004, 12:11 PM
johnbasf, I think on the wrong message board for that kind of talk. Maybe you should look at the top of the web page you are at. It's kind of like telling someone, who's wife is on her death bed, just go find someone younger with a boob job.

2KWhiteSnake
10-30-2004, 01:18 PM
johnbasf, I think on the wrong message board for that kind of talk. Maybe you should look at the top of the web page you are at. It's kind of like telling someone, who's wife is on her death bed, just go find someone younger with a boob job.


ROFL.....I agree with you John. I'd go with a Z0-6 or M3 if the Cobra was scratched. Don't get me wrong, I love my Cobra, but it's only a car. Touchy Touchy... :baby:

Craig

Silver10th
10-30-2004, 01:35 PM
I've seen your recent postings. It is apparent SVT means more to some of us than it does to you. To each his own.

2KWhiteSnake
10-30-2004, 03:33 PM
I've seen your recent postings. It is apparent SVT means more to some of us than it does to you. To each his own.


Very true, and as I've stated before...if the 07's are produced with a N/A motor I'll be the first to put down a deposit, but I won't be upset if the cookie crunchers at Ford pull the program. I want to see SVT put out a factory car that's worthy of competing with the vettes. And I'll gladly pay up to 40K for it IF it's that car. If I didn't care about SVT, I would have already bought a Z06 or M3. I patiently waited 16 months for my 01' after ordering it. I was the guy that dreamed of having a Cobra for years. After receiving my car I realized many things after actually "using" the car. I realized that for 30K, I can drive a car that will NEVER handle like a corvette or cheap 3 series BMW, no matter how much money I put into it. And it will always be underpowered (compared to it's competition) and unbalanced. Now, if I had just planned on taking the car for joyrides here and there none of this would have been an issue. Instead, I ended up getting the "open track" bug. Don't get me wrong, I LOVE the car, but I'm not going to spend good money on something that should be more refined. John Pearson (johnbasf) especially knows how hard it can be to make these cars handle. John probably put well near 15K in his Mystic. Ford knows exactly who their competition is and always has been, but they haven't wanted to "step it up". SVT better throw in a large displacement motor to compete with the Vettes (no blower). I've been on track with the vettes and I totally respect the car (even the C5's). Chevy did their homework. Sure the 03+ Cobras are quick in a straight line, but adding that weight to an already unbalanced car doesn't improve things from an open track perspective. I'm sure you saw the show "Boy Racer" on Discovery Channel. That show makes those of us that like open track drool. Drool we do, but it seems like a pipe dream. Ford "knows" what it needs to deliver to the market, but just hasn't done it yet. I think the 05's are a step in the right direction.
I guess only time will tell. In the meantime, I'll keep driving my 01 and doing track events.
And once again, I'll be patiently waiting to see how SVT handles things for 07'. :thumbsup:

Craig

cobrabitn
10-30-2004, 09:30 PM
That's an easy fix Craig.... it's called a 2000 Cobra R. If you have the bug then go for a well balanced car. I know you don't expect to pay 27K for a Cobra and expect to get 55 thousand dollar Z06 results. That would be unrealistic. :rolleyes:

Of course, you can always buy an Oldsmobile and go on the Olds board and have a big reunion once a year where you can chat about your mods..... oh, wait a minute.... they don't make them anymore. :rotf:

Silver10th
10-30-2004, 10:13 PM
Cobrabitn, the reason johnbasf and 2KWhiteSnake don't get it is because the only thing SVT and Cobra mean to them is trying to have the fastest or coolest car. They don't understand the best reason for having a SVT product. With groups like SCMC, having a SVT makes you feel like you're part of something special and you find you have friends you haven't even met yet. If all you're worried about is who you can out run or who has the fastest car you are never going to understand. There is so much more to having a Cobra than just the car.

You have done a great job with SCMC and even if SVT closes down I hope the club will be around for a long time. :thumbsup:

nckissfan
10-30-2004, 10:34 PM
from what some magazine articles make out, is that Saleen is doing a lot of the work for Ford, on the GT, the GT-R Mustang concept, and the Cobra concept. So, is Saleen going to be the next SVT for Ford? I don't see how Ford would throw the SVT people to the side. They are the ones developing race proven technology in the cars. Unless Ford has found a way to do it without them. Ford needs SVT, or whoever to keep the winning technology going. Otherwise, we will end up with stuff like the crap they were putting out in the 70's, i.e. Pinto/Mustang II.

cobrabitn
10-30-2004, 10:36 PM
Thanks for the kind words Silver 10th. You know, I spend about 30 hours a week on this club along with my 55 hour work week. It's nice to know that it is appreciated by some! :thumbsup:

2KWhiteSnake
10-30-2004, 10:39 PM
That's an easy fix Craig.... it's called a 2000 Cobra R. If you have the bug then go for a well balanced car. I know you don't expect to pay 27K for a Cobra and expect to get 55 thousand dollar Z06 results. That would be unrealistic. :rolleyes:

Of course, you can always buy an Oldsmobile and go on the Olds board and have a big reunion once a year where you can chat about your mods..... oh, wait a minute.... they don't make them anymore. :rotf:

I looooove civilized discussions. You couldn't purchase a 2K R for less than 55K when they first came out, and even at that price they wouldn't outperform the Z06 (you read all the specs, lateral G's, etc.). And in 2000, you could get a Z06 for 42K. I have basically everything the 2K R has on my car minus the 5.4 liter. The IRS on the Cobra's seem to be thought out in haste by the guys at SVT. It barely functions much better than the solid axle (which is track proven). And, for 5K more than your 04, you could have gotten a stock C5 that will rip our Cobra to shreds on the twisties. But of course, there isn't that Mustang rumble that everyone including myself loves. You seem to be a realistic guy, and you've seen how the vette shows itself at our track events. I've been in 20 year old BMW's with 100 less horsepower than manhandle our cars on track. I'm sure you've been in a few of those also. I just choose not to think of the Cobra as the end all of cars. I love the mustang styling and intention of Ford with each of the Mustangs, but to be an "enthusiast" vehicle as the Cobra is meant to be, it must be "special" in ways other than just a bigger motor and some leather seats.

Tony, I KNOW that Ford can put 400 N/A HP in a Cobra and design an incredible suspension (not something from 20 years ago) to make it a true enthusiast car. Power and Handling is what SVT needs to do, and I'm sure you would agree. To me, that is what the Cobra should be.....the essence of Power and Handling. A specialty vehicle like the Cobra MUST have both. Sure it has power, but stock handling is very lacking. How much would it have cost Ford to upgrade a few things on the suspension (which they generously patched in 03) A few hundred dollars a car? I'd gladly pay that for a car that comes out of the box ready to strike. And if it meant the cost would be in the high 30's, I still think those of us that love the mustang would gladly pay that if the car could compete on both of those levels. The Cobra is only known for being a straight line vehicle to many, but let's see Ford put it up there with the 2005 base model vettes. I WANT SVT to survive, but I want to pay money for something that has been gone over and tested with a fine tooth comb. And if I never hit the track with it, so be it. I still walk away knowing that I own one of the finest limited production vehicles out there.

That's just my .02. Btw.........I still love you Tony :D

2KWhiteSnake
10-30-2004, 10:52 PM
Cobrabitn, the reason johnbasf and 2KWhiteSnake don't get it is because the only thing SVT and Cobra mean to them is trying to have the fastest or coolest car. They don't understand the best reason for having a SVT product. With groups like SCMC, having a SVT makes you feel like you're part of something special and you find you have friends you haven't even met yet. If all you're worried about is who you can out run or who has the fastest car you are never going to understand. There is so much more to having a Cobra than just the car.

You have done a great job with SCMC and even if SVT closes down I hope the club will be around for a long time. :thumbsup:

Fastest or coolest? You don't even know John or myself, so I would suggest you keep your personal comments to yourself. I could care less how my car looks. It hasn't been washed in 9 months. People make comments to me about my lack of caring about my 30K car. It has a roll cage with no interior. Yepper, again I'm worried about how cool it looks. I'm married with a kid on the way so I don't give a **** about "looks" It's about FUNCTION. I actually use my car, I don't spit shine it every week and cruise around picking up chicks like many who have them. I don't tape up my headlights at the track, or run to get the rubber out of the wheel wells before it sticks. I just drive it. That's what a car is meant to have done to it. So b4 you accuse me of wanting to look cool, you'd best meet me first. BTW......I met John Pearson with THIS club, and all of the friends I attend events with, etc., I met HERE. John is twice your age with 2 kids in college...I KNOW he's not worried about looking cool.

Be sure to bring a bucket and some soap, because my car sure needs it. Oh.....don't forget the clay bar and some Zaino. :thumbsup:

Craig

Silver10th
10-30-2004, 11:01 PM
1st-relax
2nd- twice my age would be 74
3rd- I put 20,000 miles a year on my Cobra and don't pick up chicks. Been married since I was 17.

2KWhiteSnake
10-30-2004, 11:12 PM
1st-relax
2nd- twice my age would be 74
3rd- I put 20,000 miles a year on my Cobra and don't pick up chicks. Been married since I was 17.


Ok, then how do you rationalize that we wanna be "cooler" or "faster" than everyone else? Where did you come up with that one? :eek:

Craig

Silver10th
10-30-2004, 11:35 PM
I wasn't talking about me wanting to be JUST cooler or faster.
I'm sorry but I don't like getting into long drawn out aguments on message forums. Your gonna have to find someone else.

95SVTCobraVA
10-30-2004, 11:39 PM
Thanks for the kind words Silver 10th. You know, I spend about 30 hours a week on this club along with my 55 hour work week. It's nice to know that it is appreciated by some! :thumbsup:

I know exactly how that feels Tony :thumbsup: And I do appreciate it :thumbsup: :D :thumbsup:

:D :D :D

2KWhiteSnake
10-30-2004, 11:43 PM
I wasn't talking about me wanting to be JUST cooler or faster.
I'm sorry but I don't like getting into long drawn out aguments on message forums. Your gonna have to find someone else.

Your quote:
"Cobrabitn, the reason johnbasf and 2KWhiteSnake don't get it is because the only thing SVT and Cobra mean to them is trying to have the fastest or coolest car."

Yeah, you were talking about us. You stated that the Cobra and SVT only mean the above to us, which isn't true. John signed the petition, I don't see the need in it since it's just a rumor. Hell, in 2000 when I ordered my 2000 (had to wait til 2001) Cobra, everyone was saying that they wouldn't be making another Cobra until 2004 (even if they made one again), so I don't take any of it seriously. I'm asking how you came to the realization that John and I only wanted to be cooler and faster than everyone else.

If you don't want to back it up, then don't make your unprovoked personal attacks.

RF Cobra
10-31-2004, 01:10 AM
...for 5K more than your 04, you could have gotten a stock C5...

...A few hundred dollars a car? I'd gladly pay that for a car that comes out of the box ready to strike.

...I want to pay money for something that has been gone over and tested with a fine tooth comb.
I've been following along and find all of this interesting because I have never been a Mustang fanatic, and the Mustang has never been a "must have" car for me other than wanting to have an SVO when I was 16. However, I bought my 04 Cobra because it met all of the major "has to have this" requirements and came in at a price point that allows for upgrading while still keeping the price below that of the competition when you consider the overall package.

This is where you lose me in your argument: First you say that for $5k more you can get a C5 that will etc., etc. I'm not sure what Tony paid since his is a mystichrome, but in my case the '04 C5 is around $44,6xx.xx retail and $40,330.xx blue book, which means I would have had to pay at least $11.5-$16k more to get a C5. Then you talk about being willing to paying a few hundred extra on the Cobra. I don't think a few hundred would meet the expectations of handling presented.

Secondly, according to the final statement quoted, I don't think the vette would qualify to meet your expectations. Now you are talking the realms of Porsche and Ferrari and maybe the Ford GT (not sure how testing a car with a comb helps though ;) ). If someone doesn't want to do the modifications to improve the Cobra to where they want it, then they probably don't need to buy one. The 2005 S281 SC (400hp) or S281 E (500 hp) Saleen due out next year may be closer to your requirements (other than being supercharged). Or you could get a C5 or Z06 if you feel they are more to your liking. Again, that is your choice and what you drive does not matter to me.

If SVT is in trouble of being dropped and people want to save it, what is the big deal? If you do not want to participate in the efforts, then that is your choice and I have no problem with that decision. However, history has proven that efforts like this have made a difference in the past and I see no reason to discourage those that want to make the effort to have their opinion heard. Yes, I am skeptical at this point since all of my connections only confirm that the Lighting is gone in order to concentrate on the next Cobra. However, if Tony says he has reliable information then I will take him at his word. Ford has made a lot of bad decisions the past few years and since they are on a roll, this could be the next bad decision. After all, they can't improve the Cobra if they quit making the Cobra.

I was a member of a Ford turbocoupe car club board and the sad reality is that if SVT is dropped this board will most likely degrade to a scavanging board for parts and a here is what is wrong with my car now diary just like that board has as those with the money to buy newer cars moved on. I can understand Tony's concerns and believe they are well founded.

As anyone in the club will attest that knows us, our son is the biggest Cobra fanatic in our family now that we have one. He is only 4-1/2 yrs. old. He even thinks the SCMC "Cobra people" that he has met are the best people in the world and coming from him that is saying a lot. I think that speaks volumes to all the hard work and effort that Tony and the others that run this club have done to make it what it is and that is definately something worth trying to save. And no, I do not care to see SVT become a Shelby project.

2KWhiteSnake
10-31-2004, 01:33 AM
I've been following along and find all of this interesting because I have never been a Mustang fanatic, and the Mustang has never been a "must have" car for me other than wanting to have an SVO when I was 16. However, I bought my 04 Cobra because it met all of the major "has to have this" requirements and came in at a price point that allows for upgrading while still keeping the price below that of the competition when you consider the overall package.

This is where you lose me in your argument: First you say that for $5k more you can get a C5 that will etc., etc. I'm not sure what Tony paid since his is a mystichrome, but in my case the '04 C5 is around $44,6xx.xx retail and $40,330.xx blue book, which means I would have had to pay at least $11.5-$16k more to get a C5. Then you talk about being willing to paying a few hundred extra on the Cobra. I don't think a few hundred would meet the expectations of handling presented.

Secondly, according to the final statement quoted, I don't think the vette would qualify to meet your expectations. Now you are talking the realms of Porsche and Ferrari and maybe the Ford GT (not sure how testing a car with a comb helps though ;) ). If someone doesn't want to do the modifications to improve the Cobra to where they want it, then they probably don't need to buy one. The 2005 S281 SC (400hp) or S281 E (500 hp) Saleen due out next year may be closer to your requirements (other than being supercharged). Or you could get a C5 or Z06 if you feel they are more to your liking. Again, that is your choice and what you drive does not matter to me.

If SVT is in trouble of being dropped and people want to save it, what is the big deal? If you do not want to participate in the efforts, then that is your choice and I have no problem with that decision. However, history has proven that efforts like this have made a difference in the past and I see no reason to discourage those that want to make the effort to have their opinion heard. Yes, I am skeptical at this point since all of my connections only confirm that the Lighting is gone in order to concentrate on the next Cobra. However, if Tony says he has reliable information then I will take him at his word. Ford has made a lot of bad decisions the past few years and since they are on a roll, this could be the next bad decision. After all, they can't improve the Cobra if they quit making the Cobra.

I was a member of a Ford turbocoupe car club board and the sad reality is that if SVT is dropped this board will most likely degrade to a scavanging board for parts and a here is what is wrong with my car now diary just like that board has as those with the money to buy newer cars moved on. I can understand Tony's concerns and believe they are well founded.

As anyone in the club will attest that knows us, our son is the biggest Cobra fanatic in our family now that we have one. He is only 4-1/2 yrs. old. He even thinks the SCMC "Cobra people" that he has met are the best people in the world and coming from him that is saying a lot. I think that speaks volumes to all the hard work and effort that Tony and the others that run this club have done to make it what it is and that is definately something worth trying to save. And no, I do not care to see SVT become a Shelby project.

At the time I bought my car in 01, I could purchase a C5 for 38K and change. Yes, 8K more than my 01, and at the time, I really didn't worry about the "handling" or "power". At this point, I'd gladly pay 38K for a Cobra that is as well thought out as the vette. I would MUCH rather have a Cobra than a vette.

And no, I don't need a Ferrari or a GT (I'd love to have a GT though). I've driven and been on track in a C5 vette and it's a night and day comparison between our cars (and I have about the same HP). I just fail to understand why Ford is so far behind in handling. There is still the same amount of steel under the car, but there is a lack of knowledge behind the geometry to make it all work together. Or maybe ford just doesn't care to make it any better than the 65 mustangs of the past. Engineers that have examined the 99+ IRS say it's just not functional from a geometric standpoint. For the same amount of money they could have come up with something that was excellent, not just something to get by. Our family has owned 2 Nissan Maximas...a 96 and 2000 model. Each of which out handles my Cobra bone stock. It's much more predictable and balanced in comparison, but lacks the power. It's a little lower on the skidpad G's, but for 8K less, it's just goes to show how much a little thought into the suspension can go. And it's not a "limited production" vehicle.

My reaction to the "rumor" is as such. I went through the 99-01' fiasco and got myself stirred up over rumors and nothing more than that. Rumors are rumors, and if ford comes out and says they're considering something then I'll jump, but until I hear otherwise, I wouldn't even mention such a rumor to a fellow SVT owner because it's not entirely true. Give me a fact and I'll run with it, but what I won't do is speculate. The 07' Cobra will be coming out, and I'll have my deposit on one as soon as I get word of the specs. I smile every time I get into my car, but I'm sorry if I have bigger expectations of Ford and the Cobra. I'm amazed that others continue to let them make a mediocre car that could be so much more. Even if I had to spend 40K on it.

Craig

2KWhiteSnake
10-31-2004, 01:54 AM
Oh, on the comment regarding the new Saleens. As stated, and you recognized, I don't care for forced induction. But......A 2005 Mustang GT might be an option in the future since there is finally a "True" macphearson strut setup on the car. I have yet to drive one, but as stated earlier, I do think that it's a step in the right direction, which is very promising for the future Cobra. :bounce:

Craig

ausie
10-31-2004, 08:47 AM
It is quite difficult comparing a corvette to a mustang since they are entirely different vehicles. Since the mustang is more like a sedan (BMW comes close to the same shape) than a two seater roadster as is the case with corvette and the viper. If I had a choice in which I do, I would have bought the new Vette over the Cobra, but I prefer the Cobra simply because I like mustangs in more ways than I like the Corvette. I have to admit that the new Vette is cool looking, what I like about it is that it does not look like a vette. To be honest, I have always been a Porche Fan of the 911. Even if I had all the money in the world, I would still have a Mustang Cobra. To me the mustang Cobra is a reminder that American auto industry still can produce the American Muscle car which has roots from before I was born. Sort of owning a piece of history but in a modern sense. I would like to see Ford keep the SVT team!

As for track events, do they classify the mustang in the same category as the Vette?

nckissfan
10-31-2004, 09:28 AM
I grew up as a kid loving the Corvette. I always wanted one, and still do. Through my teen years, and into my 20's I grew a liking to the Mustang. So, I bought a 66 coupe with a V8. I always knew that the Mustang could never be what the Corvette is, and was. But, Ford has done a great job with the Mustang through the years, aside from the Pintostangs. I look at the Corvette as Americas true exotic car, because that truly is what it is. I look at the Mustang as the true American sports car. Corvette carries a great legacy, as does the Mustang, all be it totally different. The C6 vette is true to its heritage, and it does take a throw back to the 68, 69 Stingrays. The new Mustang is, also, a throw back to the 60's. I think Ford will come through, and make the best Mustang Cobra yet. They just want to do it right, and not cheat the automotive world with something lackluster. I do like the handling of my 97 vert. Yeah, there are some things it could be better in, but hell, it is what it is, a drivers car. You can upgrade the handling to your liking, and it still wont handle as good as a Vette, but that's ok with me. They are both legends in their own rights. I understand where 2kwhitesnake is coming from, and respect his opinions, and thoughts, as should all of us.

ausie
11-01-2004, 06:33 AM
Is Ford really doing all that bad? I passed through a local dealership lot and it was the first time I did not see any fords with the exception of many pickup trucks. Most of the cars were hyundai and Honda. (the dealership is one of those multi-brand dealers in one building). I thought it was strange that the only cars they had were fords were a small handful of Thunderbirds and Bullet mustangs. The dealership I bought my SVT at had no thunderbirds what so ever. Perhaps I was wrong to state the thunderbird is a flop. I just know I would not buy one. I was hoping to see the new 05 Mustang which was supposed to be released in October. So far no dealer close to me has any yet. I guess timming is everything.

Back to the original thread, I have seen the same note on other forums on the rumor or truth about losing SVT. If that is comming directly from SVT than it may just be a rumor especially if they were told not to contunue with development with the SVT lightning and concentrate on other vechicles. Limited production is just that, it is limited to how many they produce if any at all. Other rumors that Ford will outsource the production of the cobra to Roush. I guess that would explain that there are many builders out there that have their own racing version of the 05 (saleen, steeda, SHM, etc....) I have a strange feeling that the new cobra will only get 3 valves per cylinder if it will be labeled as a cobra. If I had a choice who builds the next cobra if not built by SVT then Saleen may be the best alternate. Actually I thought the contest was to create the next R version and not the street Cobra.

95SVTCobraVA
11-01-2004, 01:24 PM
Hey Tony,

I just read your letter to Bill Ford. Great letter and I hope you get a responce. :thumbsup:

:D :D :D

nckissfan
11-01-2004, 02:23 PM
I would guess that if SVT is dropped, than Saleen will be doing all the stuff for Ford. He moved into a plant just down the street from Ford. He helped build the GT-R Mustang concept, as well as help with the GT, and the Cobra concept.

2KWhiteSnake
11-01-2004, 02:27 PM
I would guess that if SVT is dropped, than Saleen will be doing all the stuff for Ford. He moved into a plant just down the street from Ford. He helped build the GT-R Mustang concept, as well as help with the GT, and the Cobra concept.

Yes, you're probably 100% correct. And of course some Roush thrown in the mix.

Craig

NewFoundPower
11-01-2004, 02:52 PM
I can see it now Saleen Vehicle Team.:barf: :mad:

-D-

RF Cobra
11-01-2004, 08:34 PM
Craig,

I agree. The development of the suspension etc. has been lacking on the Mustang over the years. The only thing I can guess is they let the modernization of the car lag for so long that they figured making any real changes would have been too costly to keep the car in the target price range and this is why they have only done the minor band-aid style improvements.

Since you also have track time I bet your perception on handling is also a lot more refined than those of us that have not had the joy of that experience yet. So while something may feel good to a novice, a person with track experience will be more sensitive to noticing the little things that aren't quite right.

Thanks for your reply to my questions. :)

RF Cobra
11-01-2004, 08:41 PM
...I thought it was strange that the only cars they had were fords were a small handful of Thunderbirds and Bullet mustangs. The dealership I bought my SVT at had no thunderbirds what so ever. Perhaps I was wrong to state the thunderbird is a flop. I just know I would not buy one.
Typically the dealerships are avoiding the Thunderbird like the plague because it usually sits a long time on the lot. Some colors are also much slower sellers than others. As a result Ford cut back on production, and since dealerships were not ordering the ones they had they just started shipping them to dealerships along with the vehicles they ordered.

RF Cobra
11-01-2004, 08:47 PM
Yes, you're probably 100% correct. And of course some Roush thrown in the mix.

Craig
That could be an interesting combination to say the least. In honor of Mark Martin's retirement they would probably do a limited edition SVT (Special Viagra Team) complete with logos and a free sample pack. :rolleyes:

2KWhiteSnake
11-01-2004, 08:48 PM
Craig,

I agree. The development of the suspension etc. has been lacking on the Mustang over the years. The only thing I can guess is they let the modernization of the car lag for so long that they figured making any real changes would have been too costly to keep the car in the target price range and this is why they have only done the minor band-aid style improvements.

Since you also have track time I bet your perception on handling is also a lot more refined than those of us that have not had the joy of that experience yet. So while something may feel good to a novice, a person with track experience will be more sensitive to noticing the little things that aren't quite right.

Thanks for your reply to my questions. :)

Any time! :thumbsup:

Craig

70Monte355
11-02-2004, 05:41 PM
I am going to pass this on to my GM car club and have them sign this petition...Believe it or not..some of us GM folks aren't that bad.

While the SVT isn't our bag, we can appreciate the fact that it is yours and I think I speak for all of us in my club that we like the workmanship and styling of your SVT's.

It seems like all the manufacturers want us to turn out RWD vehicles in on a Focus. :doubt:

And I think if any of us were in the market for a new 'car' we would be picking up a Ford because GM doesn't have anything worth while in their corral. :rolleyes:

Peace!

95SVTCobraVA
11-19-2004, 09:59 PM
A very interesting Press Release from Ford today.

http://media.ford.com/article_display.cfm?article_id=19651

:D :D :D